On 10/15/2021 at 11:02 PM, EMwhite said:
There is a guy on eBay selling PET keycap stickers for $79. How does that sit with a community that doesn't want to spend more than $49 for a full blown computer. (don't answer). Case wise, yes; but unless somebody gets hopping with a 3D printer, anything does not fit in a standard size is a non-starter. Christian's (Peri) work was so nice and the spiral bound manuals, designer pantone matched pencils and boondoggle keychains will be missed.
I believe here is 'an' answer out there somewhere but 1/3rd of the people want what I want and 1/3rd want everything for nothing; it's the middle 3rd that is tough and risky. That's the problem.
I can buy 8x11" sheets of plastic sticker paper for use in our laserjet for less than 30 cents each. That guy... wow!
On 10/15/2021 at 11:07 PM, Mtemal said:
I think it’s dangerous for the project to pursue price out the gate. The X16 community and dedication to building a new non compatible platform is what makes it special. If the pursuit was cost differentiation then the team would have reduced the X8/X18 FPGA to just be a “compatible” 6502 project like the MiSTer. Instead what we have seen is a dedication to the platform and it’s unique quirks. The development on the X16 emulator alone is one hell of a thing to take note of.
No need to circle the wagons. We're on the same team here.
For a project like this to reach critical mass, where the userbase is sufficiently large as to make it worthwhile for developers to create software for the platform, the "big picture" must be considered
along with the wants of a minority of extremely enthusiastic specialists. Unfortunately, the community on this forum appears to be comprised mainly of people who, due to their very specific desires and their fear of not getting what they want, lack the objectivity that is required to see the big picture. I will do my best paint the image, but if you still can't see it afterwards. I am not going to arguing with you.
The public facing project on the whole is comprised of:
David's fame.
David's goals of creating a modern 8 bit computer that is easy enough for one person to understand, while being inexpensive/accessible to anyone (note his non-profit statement in the first dream computer video).
A platform that has the capacity to host really fun games.
A platform that comes with all the tool required to create said games using the platform itself, including excellent documentation.
Hardware that has a nostalgic look and feel, while also having its own identity that resonates with David's audience.
A reliable, responsive hardware platform that is "instant on" and as easy to use as the Commodore machines.
A hardware platform that has lots of potential for modification.
Points 1 through 6 are the aspects of this project that are the most import to reaching the critical mass of users and developers and all of them are also 100% able to be brought to life using the small board FPGA-only design. Furthermore, this design is the least expensive manner in which the hardware can be manufactured (and physically shipped). As such, it objectively makes the most sense to launch a 100% compatible FPGA-only X16 before launching the much more complex and costly "chips and dip" version.
To the vast majority of people, the Commander X16 is nothing more than a toy. No one
needs one for
anything, yet plenty of people would be happy to pay a reasonable sum for some fun. See the
sales volume of the Gameboy (118 million) vs. the XBox One (51 million). Given that profit isn't a consideration with this project, the popularity of the platform itself is the primary measure of its success.
Selling affordable FPGA-only X16s first would put real live X16s into the homes of real live X16 users, from curious everyday folks right on up to hard core hackers. This momentum would build upon itself as more games become available and more learners become developers. That same momentum will cause even more people to buy the full sized X16 when it becomes available, which in turn will increase the platform's popularity as the community sees the successes of the hardware tinkerers. Success builds upon success and that's great for everyone!
This is the objective reality.
I know many of you here are emotionally invested in the full sized hardware and that's completely OK, your reasons are your own. However, I implore you to take a step back and consider how your protectionism towards your own personal desires harms the success of the project as a whole, because what its of the utmost importance to you is in fact only a small portion of the project as a whole.
Take from this what you will, but please know that I don't have a horse in this race; I don't much care either way if the X16 becomes a viable long term successful platform. However, many of you folks with clouded objectivity do care, deeply. I sincerely hope that I have helped you see more clearly the path towards the overall success of the Commander X16 platform, a path that will help you get exactly what you want.
