Commander X16 - Second Prototype PCBs are Here!

Perifractic · Post by **Perifractic** » Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:38 pm

Yes SNES. Please read the FAQ where the reasons are covered in more detail.

Jon Brawn · Post by **Jon Brawn** » Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:01 pm

Who's working on the prototype CRT VDU ?

troj · Post by **troj** » Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:29 pm

1 hour ago, Jon Brawn said:

Who's working on the prototype CRT VDU ?

I've got six CRTs from the 80s. One of them will work with this quite nicely, I'm sure. ?

rje · Post by **rje** » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:07 pm

It's not the color that gets me.

It's not the features like the expansion slots, VGA out, IEC interface, or the SNES adapters. Apologies to Frank, but it's not VERA either (although it is supercool).

It's not even the sockets.

It's that there's a 65C02 there, and a straightforward but clever banked memory map, on no-fuss static RAM, and it's going to run an ancient (albeit upgraded) Commodore KERNAL.

That's what gets me.

That, and maybe the SD slot.

But I like all the other stuff too of course.

DY17 · Post by **DY17** » Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:58 pm

I believe Playstation 2 controllers also use 9 connections, but have even more buttons, including the joysticks. I really like the SNES controllers A LOT, but I'm wondering why the SNES over the PS2, considering the greater number of buttons, and more modern controller. Is it a proprietary issue, cost, just personal preference?

Can't wait to get my Commander X16!!!

Perifractic · Post by **Perifractic** » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:54 pm

55 minutes ago, DY17 said:

I believe Playstation 2 controllers also use 9 connections, but have even more buttons, including the joysticks. I really like the SNES controllers A LOT, but I'm wondering why the SNES over the PS2, considering the greater number of buttons, and more modern controller. Is it a proprietary issue, cost, just personal preference?

Well, we're not looking for "the most buttons". One part of the decision over PS2 is that SNES controllers are plentiful on Amazon etc. and personally for me are a lot more nostalgic/retro than PS2. The X16 isn't a games console and PS2 really gives that vibe. But this was just one of the many reasons for SNES.

DY17 · Post by **DY17** » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:06 pm

10 minutes ago, Perifractic said:

Well, we're not looking for "the most buttons". One part of the decision over PS2 is that SNES controllers are plentiful on Amazon etc. and personally for me are a lot more nostalgic/retro than PS2. The X16 isn't a games console and PS2 really gives that vibe. But this was just one of the many reasons for SNES.

Agreed. Thanks!

-N2 · Post by **-N2** » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:20 pm

is there any technical reason why a PS2 controller expansion card would not be feasible?

StephenHorn · Post by **StephenHorn** » Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:14 am

2 hours ago, -N2 said:

is there any technical reason why a PS2 controller expansion card would not be feasible?

It could be feasible, especially with the aid of a separate microcontroller to handle the serial communications between the controller and the X16 at the likely spec of 250kHz. You'd also need to provide your own voltage division to step down the +12V line to the vibromotors' expected 7.2V, and I'm not entirely sure how much amperage that line can handle relative to the draw of the vibromotors. One source says the motors pull 300mA steady after a 500mA start-up, which ought to work out to 190mA on the 12V line after a 320mA start-up. You'll also want to be aware of the minor hazard that is the 5V TTL on the X16, versus the 3V3 TTL (apparently) for the PS2 controller. None of this seems especially difficult, it's just a variety of finicky details since the PS2 controller is a good 2.5 generations of computing removed from the X16, even allowing for the generous interpretation that the X16 straddles the 8-bit/16-bit generational divide in the same way that the PC Engine/TurboGrafx-16 did.

-N2 · Post by **-N2** » Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:38 am

19 minutes ago, StephenHorn said:

It could be feasible, especially with the aid of a separate microcontroller to handle the serial communications between the controller and the X16 at the likely spec of 250kHz. You'd also need to provide your own voltage division to step down the +12V line to the vibromotors' expected 7.2V, and I'm not entirely sure how much amperage that line can handle relative to the draw of the vibromotors. One source says the motors pull 300mA steady after a 500mA start-up, which ought to work out to 190mA on the 12V line after a 320mA start-up. You'll also want to be aware of the minor hazard that is the 5V TTL on the X16, versus the 3V3 TTL (apparently) for the PS2 controller. None of this seems especially difficult, it's just a variety of finicky details since the PS2 controller is a good 2.5 generations of computing removed from the X16, even allowing for the generous interpretation that the X16 straddles the 8-bit/16-bit generational divide in the same way that the PC Engine/TurboGrafx-16 did.

In reference to the speed limitations of the early sound chip selections, yeah I had wondered why employing another 65xx chip to run the older slower legacy components was off the table for that... running the board asynchronous might have been an elegant solution for that.