The Commander X16 has finally arrived! video

Strider · Post by **Strider** » Mon Oct 17, 2022 4:28 am

On 10/16/2022 at 6:27 PM, BruceMcF said:

I'm pretty sure I can't afford a Gen1 board, so I'm on the sidelines in this one.

Same boat. I got too much other stuff I need at the moment. I'll catch one when they're "officially" released. ?

TomXP411 · Post by **TomXP411** » Mon Oct 17, 2022 4:48 am

On 10/16/2022 at 4:27 PM, BruceMcF said:

I'm pretty sure I can't afford a Gen1 board, so I'm on the sidelines in this one.

Yeah, I'm in the hole myself, right now, and after I dig out of that hole, my car is going to need work - or replacement.

DragonGaulois · Post by **DragonGaulois** » Tue Oct 18, 2022 3:31 pm

will they make the Gen1 based on the demand or on a fixed number?

AMenard · Post by **AMenard** » Tue Oct 18, 2022 6:17 pm

On 10/18/2022 at 11:31 AM, DragonGaulois said:

will they make the Gen1 based on the demand or on a fixed number?

Fixed number for the first batch to cover the needs of those who contributed from the start to the project as it should be.

I'm perfectly fine to wait for a subsequent batch since there's always the emulator to keep me busy until I get one.

BruceMcF · Post by **BruceMcF** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 2:50 am

On 10/18/2022 at 11:31 AM, DragonGaulois said:

will they make the Gen1 based on the demand or on a fixed number?

The answer could well be "yes". That is, after this pre-release batch to finalize the hardware and prepare for the release, it would not be surprising if the release is a fixed batch, and if it is successful that paves the way for another fixed batch.

Tatwi · Post by **Tatwi** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 6:09 am

Anyone know how much the new, cheaper keyboard will be and if it will be sold separately for use with the emulator?

A keyboard with all the correct markings would be a great convenience. I considered getting a Keyrah for use in my (still working) VIC20 for use with VICE, but I never got around to getting one while they were available. One might think it would be sad to use a real VIC20 as a keyboard for an emulator rather than as itself, but that same keyboard works with the PET and C64, so that's 3 emulated computers as apposed to 1 real VIC20 that lives in a box in storage. Anyway, I tend not to use VICE and the X16 emulator, because translating the keys on a standard PC keyboard is kind of a nightmare.

Cyber · Post by **Cyber** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:03 am

On 10/19/2022 at 9:09 AM, Tatwi said:

Anyone know how much the new, cheaper keyboard will be and if it will be sold separately for use with the emulator?

Current sate of things is that cheaper low-end keyboard will not be sold separately and only comes bundeled with X16 itself.

More expensive hi-end keyboard only sold separately.

Currently no information on whether this will change in future.

Edmond D · Post by **Edmond D** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 4:54 pm

On 10/18/2022 at 11:17 AM, AMenard said:

Fixed number for the first batch to cover the needs of those who contributed from the start to the project as it should be.

I'm perfectly fine to wait for a subsequent batch since there's always the emulator to keep me busy until I get one.

My understanding is the first batch of 50 are beta boards to be used to improve the X16 to a mass production run. The video title is kind of misleading to me, but I accept that in this fast world 3 years from concept to prototypes may seem long but it is a volunteer/non-comercial product.

With simple math of $28K raised to produce 50 boards it works out to $560 per board. I'm NOT saying that would be the cost of a system, just a very rough estimate of the funds per board the team has to play with. There most likely many non-material costs we'll never know about.

Perhaps one estimate of the number of production units Dave expects to sell would be the number of keyboards he had made.

BruceMcF · Post by **BruceMcF** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 6:18 pm

Note $28,000 in donations is not $28,000 in the bank, because of various transaction costs involved in the donations. A lot of relatively small donations imply larger total transaction costs than a few large donations.

Also note that some of the costs will be one-off costs and others will be costs where an order of 50 has a higher price tag than an order of 500, so if they can get the 50 beta units made for somewhere around $24K-$25K, that points to a Gen1 pre-order price that could be somewhere under $500. Just as an example of the way that kind of thing can work out, if this includes fulfillment costs, 25% of these are non-recurring project costs, the volume price break averages to 25% and they aim at a price 20% over delivered cost, that would pencil out to a $350/board price point.

Winston · Post by **Winston** » Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:14 pm

Is Gen 1 on an ATX form factor PCB thereby allowing the use of cases designed for ATX motherboards?