Commander X16

On 10/15/2021 at 5:44 PM, EMwhite said:

So what else can we talk about that is not this topic and not off-topic?  {crickets}



 

• 
  A low cost device that almost anyone around the world can afford, given disparities in economies, etc.
  


• 
  0 input lag and other issues created by software emulation (no OS to install/manage, for example).
  


• 
  Feature rich programming environment and tools that are built into the machine.
  


• 
  A nice, unique community to create, learn, and play with.
  

On 10/15/2021 at 9:22 PM, BruceMcF said:

They haven't changed. X16p, "pro", aka "Plenty of chips", is the one you have been calling chiP and diP, X16c is the Cost reduced one, the X16e is the one with the processor core Embedded in the FPGA.



Mostly FPGA first, Mostly FPGA alongside the X16p, and Mostly FPGA after the X16p ... aka X16e, first, alongside and after ... are all quite plausible at this point.



Just "the FPGA" is a bit confusing since all three will have Vera in an FPGA, it's just the X16e will have more stuff in there alongside.



 

On 10/15/2021 at 9:45 PM, Tatwi said:

Maybe Frank will find a way to give the X8 1MB of RAM, thereby making it half of an X16! ?



Seriously though, that would be nifty. Heck, even if it were only possible to have 128KB of banked RAM on the X8, that would be enough to be useful while also allowing programmers who only have an X8 the ability to learn/use the RAM banking system (which is an integral part of the X16 design).



To answer the unique value proposition question, I think an X8 built as a 100% compatible X16 with less RAM has the following benefits:

• 
  A low cost device that almost anyone around the world can afford, given disparities in economies, etc.
  


• 
  0 input lag and other issues created by software emulation (no OS to install/manage, for example).
  


• 
  Feature rich programming environment and tools that are built into the machine.
  


• 
  A nice, unique community to create, learn, and play with.
  

If they sold a set of PETSCII stickers for a dollar or so, then a person could easily use any USB keyboard without much trouble. Similarly, some kind of cheap case would likely help folks who just want to use the machine as a retro game console.



Anyway, the low price point, compatibility with the X16, and a simple "plug and play" setup, when combined with being The 8 Bit Guy's computer, there is the potential that the userbase would grow from a small number of people with a specific interest into a large group of people who have all manner of interests and capacities. In short, a cheap and easy to use option may lower the barrier to entry to the point where the device and its ecosystem really takes off, just as it did with the C

On 10/15/2021 at 10:45 PM, Tatwi said:

If they sold a set of PETSCII stickers for a dollar or so, then a person could easily use any USB keyboard without much trouble. Similarly, some kind of cheap case would likely help folks who just want to use the machine as a retro game console.

On 10/15/2021 at 11:02 PM, EMwhite said:

There is a guy on eBay selling PET keycap stickers for $79.  How does that sit with a community that doesn't want to spend more than $49 for a full blown computer.  (don't answer). Case wise, yes; but unless somebody gets hopping with a 3D printer, anything does not fit in a standard size is a non-starter.  Christian's (Peri) work was so nice and the spiral bound manuals, designer pantone matched pencils and boondoggle keychains will be missed. 



I believe here is 'an' answer out there somewhere but 1/3rd of the people want what I want and 1/3rd want everything for nothing; it's the middle 3rd that is tough and risky.  That's the problem.

On 10/15/2021 at 11:07 PM, Mtemal said:

I think it’s dangerous for the project to pursue price out the gate. The X16 community and dedication to building a new non compatible platform is what makes it special. If the pursuit was cost differentiation then the team would have reduced the X8/X18 FPGA to just be a “compatible” 6502 project like the MiSTer. Instead what we have seen is a dedication to the platform and it’s unique quirks. The development on the X16 emulator alone is one hell of a thing to take note of. 

1. 
   David's fame.
   


2. 
   David's goals of creating a modern 8 bit computer that is easy enough for one person to understand, while being inexpensive/accessible to anyone (note his non-profit statement in the first dream computer video).
   


3. 
   A platform that has the capacity to host really fun games.
   


4. 
   A platform that comes with all the tool required to create said games using the platform itself, including excellent documentation.
   


5. 
   Hardware that has a nostalgic look and feel, while also having its own identity that resonates with David's audience.
   


6. 
   A reliable, responsive hardware platform that is "instant on" and as easy to use as the Commodore machines.
   


7. 
   A hardware platform that has lots of potential for modification.
   

On 10/16/2021 at 5:02 AM, EMwhite said:

There is a guy on eBay selling PET keycap stickers for $79.

On 10/16/2021 at 2:02 PM, EMwhite said:

There is a guy on eBay selling PET keycap stickers for $79.  How does that sit with a community that doesn't want to spend more than $49 for a full blown computer.  (don't answer). Case wise, yes; but unless somebody gets hopping with a 3D printer, anything does not fit in a standard size is a non-starter.

On 10/16/2021 at 5:33 PM, Tatwi said:

I can buy 8x11" sheets of plastic sticker paper for use in our laserjet for less than 30 cents each. That guy... wow!

On 10/15/2021 at 10:45 PM, Tatwi said:

Maybe Frank will find a way to give the X8 1MB of RAM, thereby making it half of an X16! ?

On 10/16/2021 at 7:41 AM, Oldrooster said:

I cannot find any trace of this keyboard video, or the keyboard in question or anything. I do not know where it is